TECHNOS

July 27, 2008

TECHNOS QUARTERLY Spring 1993 Vol. 2 No. 1

Interview with Jaime Escalante

With Carole Novak

Jaime Escalante is best known from the 1988 feature film Stand and Deliver, which chronicled his efforts to raise standards at predominatly Hispanic Garfield High School in East Los Angeles by training his students to take the Advanced Placement (AP) Calculus test. Expectations had been very low for Garfield students, but Escalante changed that. By 1987 Garfield was ranked fourth in the country in the number of students taking the AP Calculus test. It wasn't easy. Escalante was demanding of his students, abrasive with his colleagues, unrelenting in his insistence that everyone—including himself—pursue excellence. By 1991, he had been ousted as chair of the Mathematics Department and had moved on to other challenges, including teaching Basic Math and Algebra at Hiram Johnson High School in Sacramento. In partnership with the Foundation for Advancements in Science and Education (FASE), he is also involved in the production of a Peabody Award-winning PBS series, ‘Futures’, and other projects based on his classroom techiques. His biography, Escalante: The Best Teacher in America by Jay Mathews, was published by Henry Holt & Co. in 1988.

What would you tell President Clinton or Education Secretary Riley about the state of education in this country?

We do not have to mix politics with education. No. We have to understand that the problems we have in L.A. are completely different than the problems we have in Chicago. The problems we face are local problems—we have to tackle them with the different tools we have in each state or in each city. Money is not the only problem. Public education is a better solution than private education. We have great teachers in America, teachers who can really motivate and do the job. What we have to emphasize is the motivation of the students to do the work, to work together, and to share ideas. And we must teach in the classroom what these kids are going to be using in real life.

Do you think American education needs to be restructured or reformed?

One hundred percent.

What's the first thing you would do?

One of the things I would do is have colleges and universities prepare those great teachers who will be working with our kids by emphasizing academics. Let me put it this way: If you ask the kids about sports, they know all the names of the players and all their statistics, and when you talk about music, they know all the rap artists and their songs. But if you talk about science, chemistry, history—they don't even know what it is; they don't even open the book. Another thing is that we have to have the kind of curriculum standards that will prepare these kids for life. And it's very important for us to treat the kids in the classroom as if school was their job.

If you were a university dean of education, what would you do about your institution's requirements for teacher education?

I would emphasize academics: mathematics, science, and chemistry. Also, I would emphasize that teachers need to teach ethics, morals, and responsibility to the kids. Those are the things I think are lacking in our curriculum. Some people think that those concepts are related to religion. No, they are not. It's just logic and thinking. So we need to emphasize that by trying to develop the simple concept of responsibility in our kids.

This is the key: Colleges and universities have to make the teaching profession more attractive; and they have to prepare these youngsters to teach those concepts in high school, and to motivate their students. It's not necessary to emphasize subjects that you don't use in real life. Only three things are important to the teacher: First, to have command of your subject; second, to know how to motivate the different ethnic groups we have in this country in order to preserve the unit—because the unit, or team, will give you success; and last, to understand your kids and keep a good relationship with them. A good relationship will be a giant step to success.

Is there a need for national standards and assessment practices? Would you advocate a national test?

Yes. It's necessary to have that. It's important to prepare these kids to take a test like the AP Calculus test to know how to tackle those kinds of problems. I do teach my kids how to take the test. I tell them to find the key word, then go to the first step, and move to the next, and so on. And I have trial tests in the classroom. It's necessary; academically speaking, it puts the kids ahead for the rest of their education. They become familiar with that kind of selective test, or standard test.

Another reason I'm in favor of, for instance, the AP Calculus test, is because it tells us that we teachers are doing the job. If in my school I'm just giving out grades, and there is no kind of competition, I could tell you I'm the best teacher because all my kids got As. The test is important to prove I'm doing that. We teachers need to practice quality control. You see, that's what I do. After my kids take the test, I look at the results, and I say, ‘I blew it—I need to emphasize factoring more next semester.’ That's the only way to improve your teaching.

Accountability on the part of the teachers, too.

Naturally. And it's a kind of competition with other schools. I have a team approach; I tell my kids that they're the only school that could beat the Japanese. I say, ‘If you take this test and you score high, you prove you are prepared.’ And even though some of my kids may not score high, the ones who took the test are exposed to the experience, and I'm positive these kids will do a good job in college.

So, the discipline of studying for the test is valid in itself.

Yes—that's one of the things that helps, you know. It's another way to motivate and to have discipline, by spending a little time to prepare for the test.

Do you think the international comparisons of test scores are valid? Are the disappointing results something we need to worry about?

They are. Unfortunately, here's the situation: When our kids compete in mathematics, science, and chemistry, they rank at the bottom five among industrialized nations. Why is that? Because these kids are not exposed enough to these subjects—they are taking ‘Mickey-Mouse’ classes in high school! They are not being challenged, and the teachers are allowed to get away with it. That's why some people think private schools are better than public schools. No. The teachers have to emphasize academics, compare test results with other countries, and keep the United States number one. There is no reason why we have to fall behind. We have everything over here: We have great teachers, we have equipment, we have the new technologies. What we have to do here is to use those things and transmit to our kids that they are expected to assimilate the material. The teacher is the one who plays an important role in that.

Do you use technology—computers, videotapes, multimedia, that sort of thing—in your classroom?

Well, I do use some videotapes to motivate these kids—not the whole period; only five, ten minutes. I'm in opposition to the use of television just to kill time. Unfortunately, a person watches television on average of six hours every day. Now, that's not gonna help us at all. So that's the reason why FASE developed the ‘Futures’ tapes of my classroom, which PBS is broadcasting. And they're developing a new multimedia project to teach basic math. We must understand we have to use the new technologies. Otherwise, we fall behind. You see, many years ago, we didn't have more than long playing [LP] records; now we're talking about CDs. This is an application of new technology. What we teach in class has to reflect what the kids will use in real life, and part of that is technology. The kids have to be open to it, because it's all over. And that's the only way we'll be able to compete with Japan or any country in Europe.

Why aren't you teaching calculus courses via satellite teleconference?

I'd be glad to do it, but I would have to prepare the students in the different approach I use. For instance, for the first 10 weeks, I do not use any book. I just do experiments in the classroom to show the applications of calculus, and then I develop the things kids need to know. Because, in order to speak the language, you have to know the alphabet; in order to know the alphabet, you have to write the letters. So that's what calculus is. You have to have a strong background in all the different rules you'll be using. The second part of my course is the application of the things learned in the first 10 weeks. Teleconferencing would be good for teacher enhancement, but for now, I'm working with FASE on the multimedia project. In this case, they were impressed with the way I motivate the kids in basic math, because that's their weak point. Most of the kids don't like math; they have a negative image. FASE was surprised the way I do, for instance, fractions, so they came to this school with the cameras and they captured some of the things I do to motivate the kids. So that's part of the project; another part is algebra, and the third part is calculus.

So, basically, there'll be a series of Escalante math classes available in multimedia format?

Right. Classes, assignments, companion print materials, everything.

Let's talk about motivating students for a minute. One of the great scenes from Stand and Deliver is when your character tells the kids their ancestors, the Mayans, had developed the concept of zero, they should have pride in that, and believe they can learn math. Did you really say that to your class? Do you use a form of ethnocentric education in your classroom?

Yeah. I did say that in the classroom; I would talk about the Mayans, to motivate the kids. The movie is 90 percent true. But, you know—anybody could learn. The important thing is the kid has to be ready to learn, willing to learn. Otherwise, it's difficult for us. The minds of the kids are on basketball, music, or copying those funny haircuts, and so on. In order to motivate them, we have to touch those points they will remember. We have to use that to reach kids in different ethnic groups. I said to one kid, for instance, ‘Look, your future is not to become Michael Jordan. He's a super, superstar in basketball; you are not. Your future is to become a superstar engineer or technician, to become something positive in life. And education is the ticket to success; education is your life. So take this as an example,’ I told him. ‘This guy shoots the ball nicely; he has a really good math concept. Use that math concept in your brain to become a professional—but not a professional basketball player.’ I do pull some examples from the Hispanic community, the Black community, the Anglo community, the Vietnamese community here, and so on, to motivate.

You're not necessarily using ethnocentric education. You're using whatever it takes to motivate the student.

Naturally. That's what it is. That's the point. It goes like this: Teaching is touching life.

How would you compare your experience at Garfield High to the one you're having now at Hiram Johnson?

Well, I have three different kinds of thoughts in this regard: My experience back home in Bolivia was completely different than the experience I got from Garfield High School, and the experience I'm getting over here in this school also is different from Garfield. This is simple: Garfield High was a more homogeneous class. Mainly there were Mexican Americans, about 98 percent, or they were from Mexico or Central America. And it was easy to joke with the kids, for instance, in their language. Also, I was able to build a strong reputation with the parents, so I was well-known. Here at Hiram Johnson, I am dealing with four different ethnic groups. I have the Anglo kids, the Black kids, the Chicano kids, and also the kids from Vietnam—and I have to use a different approach when I talk to each kid.

So there really is a difference in the type of student…

Naturally. You have to understand the student. Some think you have to use psychology—no, no, no. This comes from the experience you get in the classroom. The experience that counts is that earned in the arena.

Your style seems to be that of a coach with his team. Is the teacher really a coach?

This is true. I'm just a coach. In some of the classes—for instance, in period five—the kids call me ‘Coach.’ I do ask them to have determination and to believe in themselves, to be disciplined and to put in hard work—and that's the only way they'll succeed. I say to the kids, ‘If you believe in yourself, that means you're thinking positively, and you'll make it; you're gonna do it! But, if you have a negative image about yourself, you'll really kill yourself. One of the greatest things you have in life is that no one has the authority to tell you what you want to be. You're the one who'll decide what you want to be. Respect yourself and respect the integrity of others as well. The greatest thing you have is your self-image, a positive opinion of yourself. You must never let anyone take it from you.’ And so, that's the key. I also tell the kids, ‘Keep in mind: A coach is only as good as the talent on the team. You see the Lakers—if they become champs, they're a good team. Who gets the credit? The coach! That's what I'm doing for you. If you succeed in life, it's a big plus for your last name, it's a big plus for your school, it's a big plus for the country.’

If you could give one message to young people who are going into education, who want to be teachers, what would it be?

I would say only one word: Fun. Teaching is fun. Grading papers is part of it, but it's not just that. Teaching is touching life, and it is motivating these kids to do something positive for themselves and for their country. We need good people; we need people who are responsible, people who are able to create, to innovate. If a kid can read, understand, and come up with some change, he's thinking. I have in my classroom, all around the top of the wall, the word ‘Freedom’ written, I don't know how many times. I tell my kids once they walk into my classroom, they'll have the freedom to raise their hands, ask questions, answer my questions, and do the assignments. I tell them I'm positive that they'll be a success, because I want them to be a success. One of the kids asked me how I define freedom. And I told him that freedom is the power to choose to make a change in the right direction. Not negatively. That's not freedom. I tell my kids that only five percent of the people think, and then 10 percent of the people think they think, and 85 percent of the people prefer to die before they think. I tell them to think of mathematics as just a game. ‘You follow the rules,’ I say, ‘and you're gonna be a big mathematician. You don't need anything else more than desire to learn, which I call ganas.’ If we could teach our kids how to think, how to communicate—we'd have the job done. That's what we need.

Have any of your former students gone into teaching?

Yes, a few of them. As a matter of fact, there were three teachers—one in chemistry, one in math, and one in elementary school—from the Class of ’82, the kids who made the movie. We had a reunion last year, and do you know what they told me? They said they were better teachers than me, and everybody knew it, but because I caught the eye of the media, they could not become stars! Now, that's a great class. They have pride in what they do and they are really doing a good job and enjoying it. And they told me they sometimes use the ‘Futures’ tapes in their classes to motivate their students and to show them the kind of life they can have if they study hard.

Why did you become a teacher?

I remember my mom, who was a teacher in Bolivia. She used to cut up oranges to demonstrate fractions. When I asked her why she did that, she told me this: ‘If I give you money, you'll only spend it and it will be gone. But if I teach you something—make you remember something—you'll have it forever.’ That is what a teacher does. My mom demonstrated to her students what a fraction actually was, what it looked like; they could touch it, too—it was an orange, an everyday thing. It was in their memory. It's like a computer and a disk. You put the disk in, and it works. Why? Not just because of the disk. No. Because there is a memory. But if you also add the keyboard—input something and touch and see it—you learn from it. I wanted to do that for others. Also I had encouragement from my teachers, who told me I had creativity and was independent, and that these are good traits for a teacher to have.

What do you see in the future for your students?

I worry sometimes that this generation does not realize how hard the previous generation worked for this country to have all that it has. I see it this way: Each generation must plant a tree for the next generation. Education is the water that produces fruit on the tree, and each child plucks this fruit, which is knowledge. But each generation must also work as a unit and cooperate to nurture the tree and to make life better for the next generation. And so on…

Photos courtesy of FASE.

For more information about “Futures” and the multimedia math project, contact